"I no longer have any doubts that we are in a dictatorship. The dictatorship is not imminent. It is present. I think that what they are preparing at the moment is on a scale that we have never seen in this country before," says Academician Nikolay Denkov.
DV: How do you feel about politics, Academician Denkov?
Denkov: This is a very different world. In my science, there are experiments that can confirm or refute a given statement, so that the truth always comes to light. And this happens relatively quickly. There are an enormous number of lies and manipulations in politics. The historical assessment comes years later. In many cases, it is not even fair. We know that history is written by the winners.
DV: You have spoken more than once about the lies that are circulated in politics in Bulgaria, about the untruths that we constantly hear. But even though it is clear to everyone that what is said is not true, it sows its seeds. How do you oppose this?
Denkov: Just telling the truth is not enough. When people are disappointed, they are ready to believe a lie, as long as it gives them hope. People react emotionally. Very often they forgive things that they understand are not true, as long as they meet their own emotional expectations. One of the lessons we learn is to understand that the truth must be told in a way that people can perceive with their emotions, so that they can realize it. It is important not only what we say, but also how we say it - with what words, with what intonation, in what environment, so that they believe us and support us. And most importantly - to spread it so that it reaches the most people. This is also the most difficult part in an environment where billions are poured into propaganda and disinformation, and those in power control influential media. It is also important to see people more often, because it is one thing to hear the messages on the screen, another to look the person in the eye. Personal contact is very important.
DV: How do you respond to the following reproach from people who have no doubts about which political force they want to represent them - that you do not hear them, that you impose decisions from above...
Denkov: First, let me emphasize that we are a very democratic party and in fact this is one of the biggest difficulties. In leader-led parties, whatever the leader says - it may be a lie or nonsense, people accept it because "if He says so, it must be true". With us, it's the opposite - we discuss the decisions we make both at the Executive Council and the National Council. I personally participate in many discussions in which people share a variety of opinions and quite often I join in with answers. The main difficulty comes from the fact that everyone who expresses an opinion in our democratic community believes that their opinion is the correct one. When different opinions clash, a decision must be made and it cannot satisfy all desires, which often contradict each other. And in the end, the decision must be made by the legitimate bodies so that there is direction, and not a tossing here and there. When a decision is made, there are arguments and it is good for people to hear them too.
DV: Do you manage to orient yourself in the field, do you know who is who in different places in the country? The reproaches I mentioned were on the occasion of the transfer of three municipal councilors from Dobrich to GERB.
Denkov: An essential part of our program is to visit different places. I was in Dobrich, in Shumen, in Varna. We are not many people - currently there are 17 people in the National Assembly.
When I go to Shumen, for example, I also meet with the municipal councilors, with the chairman of the municipal council in Shumen, who is not a member of our party, but is supported by us. And every time we discuss what are the possibilities to support local problems. There are several priorities that we have been working on for years - water, the development of tourism, infrastructure, the industrial zone... I can only talk for a long time about what is being done in Shumen. But in order to work in this way, we need to have active structures in the localities.
The big problem in Dobrich - the transition of our municipal councilors to GERB, is not because they have not been heard. This is not true.
DV: And why is this happening?
Denkov: I will answer generally for the country, not specifically for Dobrich. We observe the following: either people are stimulated in some way, or - as happens with mayors - they are put in a situation where they cannot do their job. And under the threat of failure - for example, because the projects for which they have already signed contracts are not being financed - they see themselves forced to do something in order to be allocated the funds they are due. So we see pressure on the one hand, and financial coercion on the other through public funds, which are our tax money. They are distributed by the rulers in a very selective way. It turns out that both mayors and municipal councilors find themselves between a rock and a hard place. Some of them give in, others do not.
DV: And why don't you explain it clearly, why don't you tell about these stories of coercion every time? Many of them remain unclear to the audience. And the interpretations are very different. Regardless of whether the pressure is legitimate or not.
Denkov: This pressure is definitely illegitimate. But in order for information to reach many people, as I said, it must flow through many channels so that it is not drowned out by the fabricated scandals that are created precisely for this purpose. Just minutes ago, in the plenary hall, our parliamentary group demanded order and transparency in the distribution of funds for municipal projects. And this was rejected by the ruling party precisely so that they could selectively choose which mayors to support, so that there would be no public information about this selective financing, so that they could continue to act in this way. Such information comes from all over the country. This is a blatant form of pressure, extortion. Artificial obstacles are being placed in the way of the mayors' work. Unfortunately, this is one of the forms of dictatorship.
DV: You say dictatorship...
Denkov: I no longer have any doubts that we are in a dictatorship. The dictatorship is not imminent. It is present. The question is how deep we will sink and how much the terror (because that is the word I use), used in the arrest of the mayor of Varna, will be massified, will escalate. And we see all the signs that it is heading that way.
DV: What happened to the mayor of Varna, Blagomir Kotsev, repeated the matrix of what happened to the deputy mayor of Sofia, Nikola Barbutov. Why didn't we see the same reaction?
Denkov: Yes, it is a matrix. There were similar actions before. For example, in relation to Petya Bankova at the customs. And there the accusations were absolutely fabricated, with obvious contradictions. It was heard that she withdrew her testimony, which has not been confirmed, but has not been denied either. This is repression that resembles the repression carried out by the specialized court before. Instead of collecting evidence to bring a proper indictment and then arresting the person, a "temporary" measure of detention is taken, which can last months. This is an attempt to literally crush these people mentally, and many of them economically. They can never restore their business, their image in society. This is terror. It is also aimed at the others who say: But wait, I could be next.
And I return to the question. Unlike people who are appointed to their posts, as is the case with Deputy Mayor Barbutov, in Varna we have a legitimately elected mayor in democratic local elections. This is the third largest city, the seaside capital of Bulgaria. The outrage is already happening on another level, which directly hits the most key instrument of democracy - the elections.
What I heard the appeal judge say - that there is not a single piece of evidence that the mayor of Varna participated in the crime for which some charges have been filed, but perhaps he knew about it and that is why he remains in custody - these are unprecedented heights. We have not seen such a thing with a public figure legitimately elected in local elections before.
They are not only carrying out repression, not only carrying out terror to scare the public - this is replacing the citizens' vote. When we combine this with the conclusions of the Constitutional Court on the numerous violations of the electoral process in the last parliamentary elections, we are already seeing the closure of the entire cycle for establishing a total dictatorship. If you control the prosecutor's office, the services and a large part of the court; if you use the Ministry of Internal Affairs as a repressive apparatus; if you have enough media outlets that you can tell what to show and you start changing the election results, the cycle is closed. We are already in a totalitarian state. The question remains who exactly is in charge - are these two people we see in front, or is there someone behind them? This has nothing to do with the principles of separation of powers, which are the essence of a democratic state.
My fear is that we are very, very deep into this process and the next months will be decisive in our attempt to push ourselves off the bottom. Otherwise, we could spend 10-15-20 years in a very difficult totalitarian dictatorship.
DV: You say that the next months are decisive. What do you expect to happen during this period?
Denkov: A significant part of society has already felt how all the repressive structures have begun to align themselves with each other. I would also add regulators such as the Consumer Protection Commission (CPC), the Competition Protection Commission (CPC) and the Communications Regulation Commission (CRC).
Right now, the plenary is discussing granting extraordinary powers to the Consumer Protection Commission, which it can abuse in an extremely ugly way, destroying businesses based on indicators that have no objective characteristics. By a subjective decision of the Commission, one or another business can be hit.
So, in addition to the repressive apparatus that we usually mention, we must also add the possibility of very severe repression against business through regulators.
All this is starting to come together and people understand that if we do not react quickly and decisively, the situation may get out of control and civil society may not be able to restore democratic order. The very fact that there are mass protests at the end of July is an indicator of the increased reaction of society. I would say that in the coming months the question will be #WHO-Whom…
Will civil society be able to stop this collapse of the institutions, as Krum Zarkov called it, which should ensure democratic rules, or will this cycle be completed by the Borisov-Peevski tandem and those who are behind them - this is truly a question of survival. If civil society fails in the coming months, from then on the possibilities for resistance will be extremely small.
My prediction is that in Bulgaria the dictatorship could be much tougher, much more cruel than what we see in other EU member states. And it will lead to mass impoverishment of the people - much more than in Hungary, for example.
DV: What is your strategy?
Denkov: In the whole picture, which is quite gloomy, there is one positive news - with our admission to the eurozone, at least on paper, we have completed our integration process in the European Union. This allows us, between the two topics - European integration and the fight against corruption - to focus on the second topic, uniting it with the rule of law.
On this platform, we can unite all kinds of political and civil forces that do not want this corpulent corruption to develop on such a scale - a scale that we have never seen before.
If there is no change on the part of the government, I expect very serious civil disobedience. I expect people to realize, if elections come, that if someone does not vote or votes with a penalty vote, they are actually voting against themselves. People need to understand this. The risk is that this life, to which they are accustomed - no matter how much they complain about it - will become much worse.
DV: Which forces do you expect to unite with you?
Denkov: We would certainly work with anyone who is ready to get involved constructively in the fight against corruption. A meeting with MECH is coming up regarding the no-confidence votes. Mr. Hristanov (PP "Edinenie") came to the protest in Sofia two days ago, as did representatives of civil organizations who realize that we are on the brink and that this should not be allowed. I think that the front will be quite broad.
I will also add something that is very important: because of the emotional stress from the assembly, many of our sympathizers from the wide perimeter easily succumbed to the lies, manipulations and suggestions from the ruling party. Boyko Borisov is very good at this. Adding to this the constant attacks with "greasy coffees" by Delyan Peevski... People were confused and seemed to have lost track of what the real problem is, who actually creates the risks and who, under the label "caring for the people", only cares about himself and the only thing he cares about is how to steal people's money.
We saw a huge, unprecedented debt for the country - greater than the debt for the previous three years. Before, a mere 5 billion would have become a terrible tragedy. Now, without blinking an eye, they have withdrawn 16 billion and will withdraw another 2 billion. We see a continuous increase in the prices of public procurement for vital projects, such as the reactors for the Kozloduy NPP, such as highways - the price of the Ruse-Veliko Tarnovo road was increased twice. All of this shows an unprecedented appetite for distributing public funds to close companies, and from there, I assume, they go to party headquarters and to some people personally. I think what they are preparing right now is on a scale that we have never seen before in this country.
DV: Do you see the president participating in such a union?
Denkov: I think the president is trying to develop his own political line based on his high personal rating, generated to a large extent by the institution itself. Let's see how they will prepare for the presidential elections or for special elections, if there are any. In any case, entering the field of everyday politics always brings very serious personal and electoral losses. Radev has the opportunity to get involved, he will have weight if he does. But I don't think that this guarantees him success.
DV: Doesn't such a hypothesis contradict his pro-Russian, i.e. anti-European line, which continues to have followers in society?
Denkov: I think that what he has been using, especially in recent months, is a highly populist approach to creating fears, often artificial fears - something that populist parties use everywhere. "Vazrazhdane" is one of the examples.
If we ask the question in another way - what proportion of Bulgarians want to be integrated into Europe, all sociological surveys in recent years show that the vast majority of them are pro-European and the percentage has been increasing in recent years. I am optimistic in this regard. What attracts me to his figure is that when you are on the sidelines, you have no executive power, you can easily criticize - especially if you do it in a balanced, intelligent way. That's how you gain popularity. But when you enter real power and have to make decisions, popularity drops. We saw this with his caretaker governments.
DV: Are you an optimist?
Denkov: In recent years, I have been using the term moderate optimist, which means that I always assess (as far as possible) the dangers, mistakes, possible victories, and together with my colleagues we try to minimize the risks and get the best out of them.
When people ask me if the assembly was a mistake, I firmly believe that if it had not been for the assembly, we could have been in the current situation a year or two ago, but without Schengen, without the eurozone, without increased incomes, without showing that there can be a different economic policy that reduces inequality, not increases it. It is very important to correctly define what is possible to happen at the appropriate time and to try to achieve maximum results.
Of course, we made many other mistakes - such as explaining to citizens in a timely manner and well enough that we would eventually have to make an assembly. This was a huge surprise and caused disappointment. Then - that maybe the assembly will fall apart because we do not agree with the demands of Peevski and Borisov to continue building their system with the recipe "one third, one third, one third". So we surprised people again when the rotation did not materialize. There were other mistakes, but I do not think that the formation of the government and the work it did was one of them.
DV: What is the most urgent thing right now?
Denkov: Let's stop the creeping dictatorship. Let's draw public attention to what is happening right now - and explain that this will affect every single person in this country, without exception. It is not a matter of one or another political leader, of one or another party. Anyone can find themselves in the path of the crushing roller that is currently passing and can run you over, whether because you have a business that they want to take away from you - and we hear such signals from all over the country, or because you simply happened to be someone else's driver and they decided that they could pressure you into perjury, as we saw with Asen Vassilev's driver. Anyone can fall victim to this machine that is advancing on a broad front at the moment. As was said at the protests, only Bulgaria is behind us.
Acad. Nikolay Denkov is a scientist and politician from the "Continuing Change" (PP), Minister of Education and Science in three governments, Prime Minister of Bulgaria, elected by the 49th National Assembly. He is the author of over 200 scientific publications, has led over 40 international scientific projects, and participates in the governing committees of three European scientific networks.